There's No Such Thing as Closure

[00:00:00] welcome to the surviving siblings podcast. I'm your host [00:00:10] Maya Roffler as a surviving sibling myself. I knew that I wanted to share my story. My brother's story. I lost my [00:00:20] brother to a homicide in November, 2016. And after going through this experience, I knew that I wanted to share my story [00:00:30] and his story.

[00:00:31] And it's taken me quite some time to come to the mic to tell it, but I knew it was an important one to tell. So here I am to share [00:00:40] his story and mine with you. And it's important that I tell the story of the surviving sibling, the forgotten Warner, the story that is [00:00:50] not told enough. So thank you for coming with me on this journey and thank you for listening to my story.[00:01:00] 

[00:01:04] The grief journey continue for me, but here comes the Pandemic. [00:01:10] 2020 as I'm going into the fourth year of the loss of my brother and this [00:01:20] shifted the entire world. This changed everything for all of us. And I can't say that it really puts grief [00:01:30] in the back seat for me, but it's. Really put a different perspective on grief for me, I [00:01:40] was forced to sit alone with my thoughts a whole lot more.

[00:01:45] So it, it did push me into a [00:01:50] unique time in my grief journey. I did feel like I regressed a little bit. I had felt like I was coming out of this time of feeling like [00:02:00] I've failed my brother and I was still feeling like, you know, I failed him. This guy's not behind bars. He there's no justice. [00:02:10] I'm fighting alone.

[00:02:12] Um, there's no army with me on this lone warrior. Maybe I have this ally across the ocean, my [00:02:20] father, but I don't really know. And. The pandemic hits. And my, the main source of income was working for [00:02:30] this is the very last company I worked for. I was working for an, a, uh, an events company, a boutique Ben's company.

[00:02:36] I ended up getting very ill. I was traveling for almost two [00:02:40] weeks, and this was in February of 2020. And I got before we were really talking about what COVID was. And I thought I was going to die. I [00:02:50] really did. And if you guys have had COVID or have seen someone with COVID to this level, I have a pre-existing condition.

[00:02:56] I have asthma, which is not crazy bad. Some people have [00:03:00] things that are tremendously horse of course, but, uh, that's why it hit me. And I've been out in Vegas and then in California and I flew, I think, [00:03:10] through Utah. And so. Uh, hit me bad. And I finally made it back home and I was sick for a month and I was really stuck alone with my thoughts during that time.

[00:03:19] And [00:03:20] I don't do well when I just have to sit still. I'm not that kind of person, which if you follow me and you've been following my story and you follow who I am and my personal life and my [00:03:30] business life. Yeah. I don't just do one thing. So having to just sit still and then like the pandemic hits as I'm like getting.[00:03:40] 

[00:03:40] So I'm reflecting a lot on things and just, oh God, I missed him so much during that time. And I miss them every day, but it was just a lot and I felt [00:03:50] every emotion again. And when you. On your, on your grief journey are there and you're alone with your thoughts and you really have to sit with [00:04:00] your grief and you really have to sit with, uh, what, what has happened.

[00:04:04] And also you're reflecting back on it three and a half years at that moment [00:04:10] in time, it's a lot to unpack and I've shared that journey with you here. And I was. Going [00:04:20] through so many emotions and I felt like, hell. So I was like, oh my gosh, like just take me. I really want. Um, to die. I really didn't want [00:04:30] to live because I felt so sick.

[00:04:31] I felt like I had failed my brother. I was really on a low, I really was on a low. And then when the pandemic really truly hit, I [00:04:40] was on a low as well because I'm an exceptionally extroverted person in the whole world shut down. And then my business, you know, I work in the events space. [00:04:50] At least. So that was my, or my predominant source of income at the time.

[00:04:55] And my husband he's my husband by then. Yes, [00:05:00] he, uh, is a chef. And so we were both really going through it professionally and we're both very lucky to still have our jobs, but. [00:05:10] I went through this awakening of, I wanted to take back my, my own kind of destiny and control. And so I ended up going out on my own [00:05:20] finally.

[00:05:22] So I went back to like circa 2017 when I wasn't running. Stable enough after the loss of my brother, when I was trying to go out on my [00:05:30] own and can sold and grow a business and, you know, started my first podcast and was trying to build a brand. And I was like, no, I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this for real.[00:05:40] 

[00:05:40] And people thought I was nuts. I mean, even the woman I was working for, but she was furloughing people. I was getting partially furloughed. And, you know, even still at my level, like [00:05:50] that's, you know, I was still doing well, it was fine. And my husband still had to. Because of the level that he was at and as an executive chef, but [00:06:00] it was hard times and I'm like, you know, what, if I'm ever going to take a risk, I truly felt like I, I was talking to my brother a whole lot at the time.

[00:06:09] And this is something I [00:06:10] recommend to like talk to your loved ones like that have passed it the other side. Like they will guide you. My brother, when I was really sick, he came through and a lot of dreams and he [00:06:20] still will come through when I have questions. And that was really his way of always speaking to me was coming through in dream and mature a little more about how he [00:06:30] comes through in dreams and in just a minute.

[00:06:31] But I just felt this push kind of like how I felt pushed to go on those trips [00:06:40] right after his passing, when I really didn't want. I felt pushed. I just felt this push. And I was very lucky that my husband was so supportive. Not that I [00:06:50] wouldn't do things on my own because I'm very strong world, but when you're married, things change, you know, you want to have a partner that supports you and [00:07:00] you want to be a team.

[00:07:02] And he believes in me, and this makes me emotional, but my brother was [00:07:10] always someone who believed in me. And I felt like it was almost like a channeling there. It was like, wow. And so I did this, I did this, I went out on my own [00:07:20] in the pandemic and it was not because you're going to go out and do events stuff on your own.

[00:07:28] In the event, industry and [00:07:30] academic events were shut down. The world is shut down. So I learned everything possible about virtual events and just went for it. And it was really hard. It was hard, but [00:07:40] I felt like. I was really doing this as a Testament to my brother and little did I realize this was the beginning of something much bigger because I'm sitting here talking to you [00:07:50] guys.

[00:07:50] And I don't think if I had, hadn't done that exactly two years ago. I don't know if I'd be sitting here talking to you right now. It [00:08:00] might've taken me longer, but my brother was that way. He just took risks. He was an entrepreneur. In the making, he had a waste to go. [00:08:10] I love you, Andreas, which you did. And, um, but he wanted that.

[00:08:16] He always wanted the independence. He never really wanted to work for anyone else. And [00:08:20] we did have that in common. We really did have that in common. And so it was tough. It was really tough. So I was dealing with that in [00:08:30] 2020, but then there was a lot of things that we all were dealing. With the pandemic.

[00:08:38] And then depending on where you were in the [00:08:40] country, I live in Atlanta. So we were in the heart of a lot of the riots and things that were happening over the summer. My husband was dealing with so many things being at the level that he was at and having to [00:08:50] let so many people go. It was, it was a tremendous amount of stress.

[00:08:55] And that was something for me [00:09:00] that even though it was stressful, I know now that it was a way in the beginning and I was paving away [00:09:10] to build my life and my destiny towards honoring my brother. And I [00:09:20] didn't even realize it just, just by building a small, like a van consulting firm that was the beginning, this little baby egg of it.

[00:09:28] And it started back in [00:09:30] 2017, but then I, you know, You know, opportunities to go elsewhere and I wasn't ready. So I thought, you know, I mean, [00:09:40] we'll never know this is a part of my journey. This is a part of my story. And this is a part of my grief story. And this is a part of being a surviving sibling. Like there's the abs and the flows.

[00:09:49] And [00:09:50] there's the lows in the hopes. And 2017 was so low for me as I've expressed in previous episodes. And. [00:10:00] I just am grateful that I ha I, I love that I did that and I, I'm not afraid to share my failures and I'm not afraid to [00:10:10] share the fact that I've fallen on my face and made so many mistakes because I also did in 2020, but I ended up having one of the best years ever, [00:10:20] uh, in 2020, which most people did not.

[00:10:23] And I didn't tell people that. Until really recently, because [00:10:30] I almost felt like a shame too, because so many people struggled, but I know that that was because I was doing [00:10:40] this kind of, not just only for myself, but I now realize this is a part of something so much bigger. I was building and teaching myself how to build things and [00:10:50] go forward.

[00:10:50] And. Be an even more self-sufficient if that was possible, but build these businesses. And so that was the start of [00:11:00] it, but it was hard. I was mentally, emotionally not doing very well because of my extrovertedness and having to be in the home all the time [00:11:10] and having to really sit and rethink all of these things.

[00:11:13] And at this point for private investigator, Not like I tried to, [00:11:20] you know, meet with them again. And like, just to even get one, I mean, it was like 20 grand. It was insane because the case had gone on for so long, the files [00:11:30] were so crazy. I mean, that was like, I had depleted resources at this point. I was starting a business.

[00:11:35] It was so tough. I, I was losing [00:11:40] hope. So that side of the, the, the kind of the spectrum that was like, definitely not. , it was like in an app, it [00:11:50] was not, you know, I was losing the hope there on that. That was a doubt. That was not a hope. The hope was the entrepreneur side of things. And you've got to be grateful for the [00:12:00] hope and, you know, kind of accept the down moments and just kind of lean into them.

[00:12:06] And I felt very defeated again. [00:12:10] There were, and you've gotta be really careful too, because if you're going through a situation like mine, there are people that will try to take advantage of you. And you've got to really trust your [00:12:20] gut and trust your guide, which I, I believe our, our, our loved ones that have passed on the other side.

[00:12:26] And, you know, I didn't feel like these people were the [00:12:30] master. So, you know, I continue to write to, to local counsel and try to help have people help me. And I still pounded the pavement, but there's only so much you can do when you're in a [00:12:40] pandemic and government shut down. And so I felt like I was in like in this kind of holding pattern again, and it was tough.

[00:12:49] And you kind of [00:12:50] have to put your, I don't want to say emotions on the whole, but like you kind of have to put yourself in a holding pattern and so fresh. [00:13:00] 'cause you were like feeling like you failed this person, let alone, you're still grieving. You're still grieving. And [00:13:10] you don't have any closure. Quote, unquote, this is a big thing.

[00:13:14] People think like you need closure, you need closure, you need closure. And that's what I [00:13:20] was seeking. I was seeking closure. I was seeking closure. I was seeking justice. I was seeking all of these things and I was kind of going crazy, you know, to a certain degree. [00:13:30] And life goes on, whether you're going crazy with here, grieving, whether you're, and that's so hard to hear.

[00:13:39] And I [00:13:40] want to smack people, like when they say that I want to smack them when they're like, I, it goes on. Okay. Let's like, get in the top 10 worst [00:13:50] things, which I'll do a poster. Maybe I'll talk about that on the podcast. It's about. Top 10 worst things to like say to someone life goes on. Well, yeah, no, no crap.

[00:13:58] It goes on like life. [00:14:00] Yes, it goes on. But my point in saying it is yes, life is moving on. That's why it is so hard. Like there's a, there's a secondary part of [00:14:10] my statement. Life is still moving and you feel like you're not like you're frozen to bed some days you're sometimes having to get out of bed and go to [00:14:20] work and you feel like a zombie and like, I'm sure you've felt this way.

[00:14:25] Or maybe you feel this way right now as a surviving sibling. Like how is this life [00:14:30] even real? And yes, I still was going through those emotions in 2020 and my husband and I were renovating our condo. We had bought, [00:14:40] uh, a new build home and we're finishing that out. We moved into that. So there's just a lot going on, you know, and here I am doing this business.

[00:14:49] I mean, I [00:14:50] was totally nuts and I think there was a part of me that was. Putting a lot on myself to distract myself. And I had, you know, really throw myself into this [00:15:00] relaunch of my other podcast, which is a leadership podcast for women and was building a brand off of that. It was just what helped me create this podcast that I hope is hoping you, [00:15:10] and you know, it was all part of this journey, but it was a lot, I put a lot on myself and I was really exhausted and I was having some emotional breakdowns [00:15:20] and it was.

[00:15:22] It was really tough. And I always struggle in September as well [00:15:30] as November. November is of course the death date of my brother. He was officially declared dead. He was shot on November 19th, but he was officially declared dead on [00:15:40] November 21st. So that's when Andreas was that's his death date or his death anniversary or death.

[00:15:47] We have many names for it, right. As [00:15:50] surviving siblings, but Andreas and I shared a birthday, which I have shared in previous episodes, but sometimes I'll repeat some things just in case you're tuning in at different [00:16:00] times, but Andrus and I shared the same birthday. Um, we were not twins. We were three years apart, but we had the same due date.

[00:16:08] We were both two weeks late and we [00:16:10] both weighed the same and we have the same birthday, which is the 21st of September. It's also odd that he died on the 21st. The 21st is a significant number for me. And I [00:16:20] also am like into numerology and things like that too. And number three is like a very special number and things like that.

[00:16:27] So it's a whole other [00:16:30] thing to talk about. September is a hard month for me because we shared this birthday together. And as kids, you kind of like go through again, [00:16:40] the ebbs and flows of life. And there were times that we thought it was so cool and then we hated it. And then of course, as adults, that was really cool that we had the same birthday.

[00:16:48] I mean, and then of [00:16:50] course, like same due date, two weeks late, like that's crazy. Like, mom, dad, what were you guys doing right now? I think it was way deeper than that. I think that. We're very, very [00:17:00] deeply connected. And I would find that out later as I traveled down more of a spiritual path, which I'm going to share with you, but which came up [00:17:10] in 2021.

[00:17:12] So I was really struggling in September of 2020. I went back into a depression. It really did [00:17:20] really did. I was struggling with just my. Even though I was doing well, I was struggling with my business. It was hard. I was struggling with [00:17:30] the fact that you couldn't be around. People still was still pretty closed off in the world.

[00:17:34] Um, couldn't travel, lik this is first world problems, but like, I always traveled for [00:17:40] work and I wasn't traveling for work. And, you know, I couldn't even like travel summer random for my birthday. I couldn't even like go to like, you know, I don't know somewhere for my [00:17:50] birthday. I didn't care where it was.

[00:17:53] That's just who I was. And so I was really having a hard time and I [00:18:00] was just sitting in bed one Sunday. And of course my husband's working, you know, chefs work these crazy hours. He's, you know, typically working on [00:18:10] weekends, he had either like Monday, Tuesday off or something like that, it was hard during the pandemic though, because it was typically one day, if you've done that because [00:18:20] of the staff.

[00:18:21] But I was sitting there in bed Sunday with my dogs and, um, I think [00:18:30] I was like drinking a mimosa, trying to have like, you know, these self care was so big during the pandemic. And I still think self care is big, but I think we need to change [00:18:40] the narrative on self care. I think we need to talk about, it's not just sitting in bed having a mimosa, right?

[00:18:45] It's all. Listening to a podcast like this and connecting with people and like [00:18:50] self care for me is like answering your messages. So like, if you ever want to chat or something, send me a message on my website or whatever. I love talking like that. Self-care [00:19:00] for me is giving back sleeping, resting. A bubble bath.

[00:19:04] Isn't really self care for me. It might be for you, whatever self care is for you going for a walk. [00:19:10] Like I think we need to change the narrative on self care, like going and getting a Manny and petty. Like that's like, that's a necessity for me. That's not like I need to look [00:19:20] good for my job. I actually did.

[00:19:22] I find that to be self care. So like, let's make that, let's normalize that just saying, and [00:19:30] as a surviving, like sibling, as someone who's gone through grief and is still grieving and will grieve for the rest of my life, I want you to know that that's normal and some people may find those [00:19:40] things to be self-care.

[00:19:41] I don't sitting with my dogs and hugging them and. You know, watching a movie that reminds me of my brother or happy times or things like that. That's [00:19:50] self care for me, actually forcing myself in a positive way to do nothing and like enjoy a book or connect with a person or be in the moment [00:20:00] that's self-care so that's my little preach there for you.

[00:20:04] And hopefully that makes sense. Cause we need to change the narrative on that. I really think so. [00:20:10] How is doing some self care. So I thought at the time, and I think it was because this was interesting. So I'm sitting there with a little mimosa or whatever I was drinking [00:20:20] and with my dogs in our, in our new home.

[00:20:24] And I was kind of stressed, um, because we had the condo store, I was trying to decide like, you know, we put it up for [00:20:30] sale, I think at that time. And I was trying to figure out, do we rent it? Do we not? Like, do we keep it, you know, I invest in real estate too. And it was just a whole thing at the time. And I was like, [00:20:40] no, I need to unplug just like I was talking about.

[00:20:42] So for some reason, this is not typically me. I'm like, I'm going to watch first 48. This is not a show that I [00:20:50] typically watch, but it was like randomly my TV turned that on. Like, we're not big, like cable people typically we're typically like the Netflix people or like [00:21:00] peacock and all that stuff. Right.

[00:21:01] When we watch TV. But it was randomly like on that channel. Cause we have it like on our TV, just there. So it was [00:21:10] on this cop show first 48 and it caught my attention because it was Atlanta. And I'm like, okay, this is a little weird. Maybe this will make me check out a little bit. I'll [00:21:20] watch this. I am not kidding you.

[00:21:22] I started watching this. This is early September 1st week of September. And I'm like [00:21:30] shaking and telling you about this and I'm watching it. And I'm like getting into the episode. I'm like, this is really wild. You know, it's always about homicide and things like that. And I recognize a [00:21:40] lot of the areas I live in the city and I'm watching this detective on there and he's just like, he's talking at my heart.

[00:21:48] You guys like really tugging at my [00:21:50] heart and I'm really connecting with him. And I'm like, who is this guy? We're going to call him [00:22:00] the room, call him detective G. That's not his name, but, um, we'll get to, I we're going to call him that. But detective G is, I'm watching him [00:22:10] on TV and I'm just like, wow. And I get into like episode two or three and I'm like, So like [00:22:20] just compelled by him, by the way he is handling the cases, he show enthralled and determined for justice, but [00:22:30] it's how he handles the families, how he was speaking to the moms, especially.

[00:22:37] And then also I saw an [00:22:40] episode with siblings. I started just crying. Like I'm crying right now, telling you about this. I was so moved [00:22:50] by this detective and I'm seeing him all over these places, very close to where my brother was shot. And I'm like, this is so [00:23:00] weird. And so I continue to watch, and it must've been the third or fourth episode and lo and behold dirty detective, they show a scene.[00:23:10] 

[00:23:10] Detective G is in the office with the dirty detective and he is on one of the episodes, my heart, you know, [00:23:20] that feeling where you're hurt, like sinks into your stomach and you feel like you're going to throw it up. That's what happened. I couldn't believe it. My jaw dropped a shot up in bed. I [00:23:30] started texting my husband and I was like, oh my God.

[00:23:32] Oh my God. I'm I got on my car and. He didn't always respond right away when he was in that role, because he was like, he had laid off like so many [00:23:40] people, it was terrible situation. And so I was like, oh my God. And I think I got, sorry. I just I'm, I'm a glued to the TV at this point. [00:23:50] And I'm watching more.

[00:23:51] I think I got through, I don't know how many more episodes and I'm like, I'm going to find this man not dirty detective. [00:24:00] This detective I'm like, he I'm like, I'm going to find him. I'm like, how am I going to find him? I'm like, it's a Sunday. How am I going to find it? I'm like, I'm going to go on social media.

[00:24:09] I'm going to go. I'm [00:24:10] going to hit Instagram. I'm going to hit, okay, Facebook, I'm going to hit every demographic. I'm going to hit Twitter. I'm going to hit. I don't think he's going to be on Tik talk because you know, like I'm [00:24:20] just figuring out Tik TOK. And I'm thinking he's older than me, so I'm not going to hit there.

[00:24:23] So I hit, um, and, and LinkedIn. So I have. And I wrote him my story. And I [00:24:30] said, look, I'm watching you on the show. I was like, I'm so touched by your, your stories and how you, you know, your experience. And I like wrote this heartfelt [00:24:40] message, as long as I, you know, it would allow me on there on each, on where I could find him.

[00:24:45] And I just put my phone down and I was like, took a sip of my little mimosa, [00:24:50] you know, and went back to watching the show and went back to watching him. And I was just like glued to this detective G. And wouldn't, you know, I don't even think it [00:25:00] was two hours. He wrote me back.

[00:25:06] You want me back on Twitter? And [00:25:10] he said, Hey, Maya. He's like, I'm in the mountains right now with my family. And he said, you know, um, can you, [00:25:20] you know, basically long with the shore. He'd like to help me. Can you tell me more about your case? Like who was your detective? All of that information, blah, blah, blah.

[00:25:29] Cause they didn't [00:25:30] tell him at the time and before I could even write him back. Cause I didn't know he had messaged me yet. I didn't get the notification right away. Cause I don't keep all my notifications on. They'd be going crazy. [00:25:40] He said, nevermind. I found it. And he named the dirty detectives name. He goes, when I get back to the city, he goes, I'll open your file.

[00:25:46] And he goes, I will give you. [00:25:50] And so I gave him my information and I think Tim, like a million times, and I was freaking out like freaking out and I ended up calling [00:26:00] my husband. I'm like, oh my God. Oh my God. You're never going to believe this. And I tell him the story, just like, I'm telling you. And he's like, oh my God, that's crazy.

[00:26:06] He's like, you don't watch stuff like that. I'm like, no, like, no, [00:26:10] like I'll watch snapped and murder shows and stuff like that, which is weird probably. But. I don't watch these like cop shows because this to me, these cop shows are a [00:26:20] little closer to what I actually going through, which again, might not sound connectable to you.

[00:26:26] I don't know. But, or maybe that makes total sense to you, but like, [00:26:30] I'm actually going through this right now. So I can't like watch those typically. And for some reason that day I did sure enough, he gets back to the [00:26:40] city. He calls me first thing Tuesday when he's back. And he is [00:26:50] incredible. And the reason I call him detective G is because one, I never, I don't want to unveil his identity.

[00:26:55] Some of you may figure it out. Um, he's on first [00:27:00] 48 all the time. He's an absolutely incredible man, but he actually calls me and he's like, Maya. I'm like, yes, he's [00:27:10] like, this is. Gee, this is what we're calling him. And I'm like, oh my God. I'm like, hi. And he's like, you have some time to talk. And fortunately I did because you know, I'm working for [00:27:20] myself and I'm like, yeah.

[00:27:21] And he's like, look, I pulled out the case. He's like, this is. Really, you know, this is a lot and he goes through the entire case with [00:27:30] me. And that I've shared with you guys already. And I'm like, yes, I'm aware. He's like, it looks like the previous, you know, dirty checked I'm this. And I'm like, what has been going on though?

[00:27:38] I said, can I ask? [00:27:40] Because like, I've called him. And he tells me that this particular gentleman, dirty detective was actually promoted. And just, [00:27:50] that was it. And I was like, but I called him and called him and he was like, yeah, I think it had been almost two years since his things, and that's why the phone had [00:28:00] stopped.

[00:28:01] And I was like, why wouldn't anybody tell me, like, why would this, I don't know. He's like, I'm so sorry. I don't know. I have no idea. I'm like, [00:28:10] okay, like what do I do? What, what happens? And he's like, well, I'm like what happened? And like did the bullet from my, you know, again, trigger [00:28:20] warning here, guys, if this is too graphic for you, I'm going to talk about the bullets and stuff.

[00:28:25] I said did the bullet from my brothers, you know, brain where it was lodged in. I said, did that ever get [00:28:30] matched to the two guns that were identified? You know, did any of that happen with forensics? It was so backed up. He kept giving me the run around. Did you guys ever get the final interviews? You know, I asked all these questions [00:28:40] and he obliged and he said, you know what?

[00:28:42] He goes, I'm going to get, I'm going to get the gun out of evidence because it, it am seeing in the report. It was the smaller gun [00:28:50] guys. Like I said, I knew it was that when it wasn't this shot. Ricochet story that he, you know, these guys had concocted, it was the smaller gun. [00:29:00] So that gave me chills right away.

[00:29:01] I was like, oh my God, like, it makes me emotional to this day. He's like, I'm going to get that out of evidence. We still haven't. I said, [00:29:10] okay. He goes, I'm going to make sure forensics takes the bullet and goes over there. And, and it gets, it gets done. We make sure this happens. I'm like, [00:29:20] oh my God, I had to hold it to.

[00:29:24] 'cause I felt like, oh my God, like this is happening. This is finally happening. [00:29:30] Like something is finally happening and I couldn't thank him enough. He was like, look, I can't make you any promises. He's like, this is really tough. He's like really, really tough. And [00:29:40] I was like, what is this case considered? I said, this is really hard for me to ask, but what is this case considered?

[00:29:45] Because you know, it's almost four years. And he said, yeah, unfortunately [00:29:50] he said, this case is considered. And I, I cried. That was really hard for me to hear. And I asked him, you know, why? And they said, well, he [00:30:00] said, I don't know, because this wasn't my case. He's like, well, let me look at it some more, let me get this stuff out of evidence.

[00:30:05] You know, he said, but he goes, and I'll tell you, you know, my professional opinion and how I [00:30:10] would have charged this case and how I would've handled it. He's like, but he's like, you know, there's a statue of limitations of two. Which I knew about, which is [00:30:20] why I was me personally, which is why I was so adamant about going after this and getting the paperwork and why I felt like in 2019 that I have [00:30:30] failed my brother and just like so many things were going on with me, but I also know different things can happen.

[00:30:35] Like things can get reopened. Things can happen. Miracles happen, things change. [00:30:40] But hearing that from him, And I said, how did this case get closed? I said, how did this happen? You know, we never went to court. We never heard anything. We never, [00:30:50] he said, yeah, he said, it looks like based on this file, that detective dirty, as I call him, just basically dismissed it as, [00:31:00] you know, dismissed it and let this guy go because he turned over the guns and wrote it off as an accident.[00:31:10] 

[00:31:10] And I was like, what? And he's like, yeah. He's like, well, it looks like that based on the file because he came in, he admitted it and turned over the guns and he didn't have a record. [00:31:20] I have never felt so sick in my life because one, I was right about everything too. I know it was not an accident. Detective G did not.

[00:31:29] Um, [00:31:30] believe or allude to that either. Although professionally, he can't say that, but he said, let me, like he said, let me, before we go even deeper into this, he goes, let me do a full analysis of the [00:31:40] file. I said, okay. It was hard to hear that though. And so he hung up and he did every thing. He said [00:31:50] that he w that he would do, he got the gun right out of evidence.

[00:31:57] Finally got that. Analyzed [00:32:00] shocker guys. They matched the gun was registered to that. Gentlemen. [00:32:10] He could have come back and gotten that gun at any time too, if he cause he wasn't charged and he never did. [00:32:20] Interesting. Right. Interesting. I think someone who's not guilty. Would come back and collect their items.[00:32:30] 

[00:32:30] Interesting. It took about a week or so. It was before my birthday and my brother's birthday. He called me back and he had a [00:32:40] long conversation with me and he would text me updates as well. I'm telling you this man was another angel in my life [00:32:50] and it was like the best birthday present I ever could have.

[00:32:54] And he said to me, he said, you know, my, okay, I'm going to give you the whole scope [00:33:00] here. And I said, okay. I said, I'm ready. And he basically told me a lot of what I had already told you, you know, they [00:33:10] couldn't really charge him with anything because he didn't have. That was one thing. I was like, what? He goes, look he's like th that would not have been my decision.

[00:33:18] I'm reading the [00:33:20] file to you. He goes, Ben, I am telling you there's the bullet and the gun match. He did kill your brother. It was, it was a lot to hear that. [00:33:30] And it was also a lot to hear that I was right. It was not this shotgun that was shot off accidentally and ricocheted and hit my brother in the face.

[00:33:39] No, [00:33:40] it was the small handheld gun. Did hit my brother and kill him and I was right. So if you [00:33:50] think something is wrong about a situation, I'm going to side note this for a second to you as a surviving sibling, if you think something is wrong about this story, or you believe that, you know what happened or are you thinking [00:34:00] your gut trust it because you're right.

[00:34:02] I'm telling you right now, you're right. You know, the truth, you know, you know the [00:34:10] truth. Okay. That is your sibling. That is your connection. That is a part of your soul. You came out of the same people. And [00:34:20] even if you're not blood related your soul related, if this is like a soul sibling, you are connected, you know, trust your gut.

[00:34:28] I was right. And I [00:34:30] spent four freaking years questioning myself. And I think God for detective G every single day and. [00:34:40] He went on to tell me that, you know, because he turned over the guns and because he admitted it detective dirty, I [00:34:50] guess, you know, he had the power, I guess, almost so with his promotion.

[00:34:54] And there's just so many cases that he decided to just throw it out because the most they could have charged him with [00:35:00] was a manslaughter. And you know, most of those guys get out after two to four years tops, tops. So he may have served. [00:35:10] And I needed a moment after that. And you know, Dr. G said, he said, look, I'm going to keep an eye on this guy.

[00:35:17] He said, I am, I believe him. [00:35:20] And he's like, you can call me whenever you want. We talked for a long time about everything, about all the details about the gun. I've got a lot of things that, you know, would probably bore you guys [00:35:30] to death to listen to. And if you ever wanted to talk to me about it or. Talk more about it.

[00:35:34] I, I can talk about it, but, um, because it's considered quote unquote close, which doesn't [00:35:40] mean, you know, there's still perhaps not justice to be served for him, but, you know, I do believe things come to people who do terrible things, but the [00:35:50] part of the conversation was that was more important was that, you know, this man was like, look, I've been doing this for almost [00:36:00] 25 years and this is really.

[00:36:03] And then he goes, look, I don't know this wasn't my case. So I don't really know what happened. You know, I can't, all I [00:36:10] can do is look at the facts here. He's like, it doesn't look good. He goes, it looks really weird. And he said that to me, it looks like. And he goes, it it's a homicide case, you know, [00:36:20] he's like it's on his death certificate, it's a homicide, he was killed.

[00:36:23] He was murdered, you know, whether it was an accident or not. And he goes, I can't say that, prove it, disprove it [00:36:30] because you know, the detective dirty as I have to call these nicknames to bring some like levity to, because it angers me that someone would do this and just not care [00:36:40] about a life like this, you know, but he said, you know, Maya.

[00:36:44] I have to tell you something. He's like a couple of things, because for the record had [00:36:50] this been my case, he goes, this man would have been charged. He goes, I would have gone for what ever the maximum I can get. Even if it was the [00:37:00] manslaughter, he goes, he would have been charged. There's no way I would not have charged him.

[00:37:03] So I am so sorry that this happened. I can't tell you guys how much that meant to [00:37:10] me, just to hear that from someone to know. But my brother had had injustice to know that someone [00:37:20] that is, you know, not someone that aired one time on this show, but someone who's consistently on a reputable show and is a good person [00:37:30] and cared enough.

[00:37:30] I'm sure this man is so busy with cases. He took the time to text me and call me and stay in touch with me. And he's still available. If [00:37:40] I want to speak to him to this day. What does that say about him versus the other person and what he said? I take as truth. [00:37:50] I take that as truth. And so for him to say that, I said, I appreciate that.

[00:37:55] He goes, if this was my brother, I would want to hear that. And I would want to [00:38:00] know that. And he goes, and I treat every case. Like it's my brother, my sister, and my mother, my friend at all. [00:38:10] And I knew that just watching him on TV and I will tell you, he is, and this is not always TV guys. Cause I shared with you a previous episodes.

[00:38:18] I've been on TV and it's not all [00:38:20] real, he's real, he's the real deal. And so, you know, you could probably figure out who he is, but I call him Dr. G because or detective G going [00:38:30] I'm Dr. G. Right? Because I feel like he's giving me therapy. He's detective G though, because he's detective good. It's detective great.

[00:38:39] He was [00:38:40] incredible and is an incredible person. He's a beautiful family, man. And I'm telling you this because there are good cops out there and there are some really dirty ones. [00:38:50] And you have to just trust your gut. No, but just when you thought this couldn't get better, it did. I mean, like this is a horrible situation [00:39:00] and there was a lot of beauty to it because he gave me so many gifts.

[00:39:05] He gave me. You know, all this information that I've been [00:39:10] searching for and fighting for. And I was so tired. I was so tired and, you know, here I was struggling through a pandemic, just like all of us in grieving [00:39:20] Turrell situation. And he just spent time talking to me. It was a long conversation, this conversation and.

[00:39:29] He [00:39:30] shared a couple other details, you know, about him. He made sure he looked through the records of, you know, this guy and, you know, wanted to make sure I felt safe. And I shared some of the other people [00:39:40] and, you know, he, he looked into all this. He wanted me to be safe. It was, I was just blown away. But, you know, I told him [00:39:50] this was the most poignant part.

[00:39:51] I think of the conversation besides getting the information and, you know, just knowing that. This was done wrong and that justice should have been served for my brother. [00:40:00] And that had a real true detective like him pet on the case. Someone not just looking to slide these cases off his plate so he could [00:40:10] get promoted.

[00:40:10] But someone actually going after justice would have charged this man because he did murder my brother and I was right the whole time,[00:40:20] 

[00:40:20] just when I thought. I had so much and enough to just feel like, okay, I did fight. I did do something for my [00:40:30] brother. I said to him, I said, you know, detective G I said, I don't, I don't know. But it is, I've been fighting [00:40:40] for almost four years now. And, you know, I guess I, I guess I was just looking for closure or something, or I don't know what it is that we're looking for.

[00:40:47] You know, it's been my journey with [00:40:50] this and he said, you know what my, I said, I've been doing this for, I think he said almost 25 years at that point, I'm sure it is now, you know, around there. And he said, can I [00:41:00] tell you something? And I said, of course, you know, anything of course. And he said, I don't think [00:41:10] there is such a thing as closure.

[00:41:14] And it was like, what do you mean? He said, I don't believe that closure [00:41:20] exists. I only believe in answers. And I just sat there. You guys [00:41:30] blew my mind because. He was right. And he is right. [00:41:40] And I said, detective G, oh my God. I said, thank you for that. And he said, look, I've done it a long time. He goes, I had to tell, you [00:41:50] know, mom's sisters, brothers, mothers, fathers, sister, grandmas, you know, every I've grew up everybody, you know?

[00:41:57] And he's like, it's not, it's not [00:42:00] closure. That happens. It's a. And when people get the answers that they are needing, they come to a place where they can. It's not [00:42:10] really about also, you know, we elaborated and continue to talk a little bit. It's not really about quote unquote, like moving on, like forgetting [00:42:20] about the person, but they're able to say, okay, I know now, and they can accept and they it's still not.

[00:42:28] Okay. It's still not right. But. [00:42:30] It's the unknowing. It's not having the answers. It's not about closure. You're never going to have there. There's no such thing as closure. [00:42:40] There's only answers. That was the most powerful thing anybody has said to me in this entire grief [00:42:50] journey. And it came from someone who sat like a desk away from the person who was like, Basically [00:43:00] not giving justice for my brother.

[00:43:02] It's so crazy in life, how that can happen. And I think 29 times, and he said, if you ever need anything, if you ever need me to go dig [00:43:10] up anything, if you ever think anything, the thing is different and he goes, I can help you with it. And he goes, but unfortunately, this is where this case is, but you need to know I would have charged him and I would have given him the maximum.

[00:43:19] [00:43:20] And this is the. What would have happened and you would have deserved that and you do deserve that as his sister. And he deserved that. And I'm so sorry, [00:43:30] that's the best gift anybody could have given me. And I hope that he is giving you a gift to, by me sharing this [00:43:40] because I think we all deserve the answers.

[00:43:44] You know, I, I think it's really important. He gave me permission to not [00:43:50] feel the pressure of having to have this closure of having to okay. By, by two years, I've got to have it together by four years, by five years, by 10 years by no, [00:44:00] no, there's no such thing as closure there's answers. And it truly gave me [00:44:10] a sense of like, okay, there wasn't justice.

[00:44:15] Wasn't. Um, this is the truth I can fill in the blanks [00:44:20] from here. I'm uh, I'm, I'm not okay with what happened, but I think God for this man, and I know my brother led me to that TV that day. [00:44:30] That was just way too weird. It was way too bizarre. And that really carried me through [00:44:40] 2020 and my ability to, you know, do.

[00:44:44] Grieving and really know and accept [00:44:50] what happened, but except in a way, knowing that people knew that there was an injustice that happened because I wasn't forced to [00:45:00] do like this closure. I wasn't, you know, I didn't feel like I had to have closure in my life. No, it's okay. I can tell my story. I can talk [00:45:10] about it and.

[00:45:12] I even opened up and did my first interview in 2020 and talked about my brother's [00:45:20] death, which was so hard. And looking back on that girl, now, she'd be so proud of me sitting here talking about this right now. [00:45:30] I got on a video and talked about, um, like a video interview video podcast and talked about my brother's death for the first time open.[00:45:40] 

[00:45:40] With the public. And I look back at that 2020 Maya and I'm like, thank you so much. He [00:45:50] will never know what that did for me. And how that changed my life in this, in this grief. And how I think that will change [00:46:00] also my family's life because they, they don't know that information. And I hope that one day I'm able to share that with them.

[00:46:07] I hope one day that it will help them [00:46:10] in their grieving journey, in their healing journey. And I really hope it helps you. And I hope that hearing that from detective, detective G my detective [00:46:20] good, because for someone to go the extra mile, it, it just totally outshines the. Who did an injustice to you?

[00:46:29] Because [00:46:30] my brother wasn't just killed once he was killed twice. Those are my answers. That's how I got those answers. But I, again, I'm so grateful for you, detective [00:46:40] G and if you ever listened to this, you know who you are, and I really appreciate you. And for all of you surviving siblings, just know that don't be forced for closure.[00:46:50] 

[00:46:52] I agree. In my opinion, I don't think true closure exists. I think what we're really seeking is [00:47:00] answers. So all there really is, is answers. So get the answers that you really need. And I found that these answers [00:47:10] carried me into 2021, but there were just a few more than I needed before I was able to start sharing my journey and my grief journey with you [00:47:20] on this spot.

[00:47:23] Thank you so much for listening to the surviving siblings podcast. If you enjoyed this episode, as [00:47:30] much as I did creating it for you, then share it on your chosen social media platform. And don't forget to tag us at surviving siblings podcast [00:47:40] so that more surviving siblings can find us, remember to rate, review, and subscribe to the podcast.

[00:47:47] And don't forget to follow us on all social media. [00:47:50] We're on Instagram, Twitter, and tick talk at surviving siblings podcast. All links can be found in the show notes. So [00:48:00] be sure to check those out too. Thank you again for the support and until the next episode, keep on surviving my surviving siblings.[00:48:10] [00:48:20] .